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 From:  David Rodgers <david dot rodgers at kdsi dot net>
 To:  m0n0wall at lists dot m0n0 dot ch
 Subject:  RE: [m0n0wall] Comparative Products to M0n0wall
 Date:  Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:01:36 -0600
On Thu, 2004-03-11 at 07:20, Richard Morrell wrote:
> Some of the points made are a bunch of crap people:
> 
> 1) I invented SmoothWall/IPCop so credit me with some knowledge before flaming 
> me
> 2) One major thing that SW/IPCop has because of how I designed the technology 
> on a cigarette packet in a pub 4 years ago - pre any code being committed was: 
> Connectivity. There is no firewall application device on the planet that has 
> modem, ISDN, Cable, DSL, USB ADSL and the connectivity methods SW has. M0n0 is 
> purely ethernet so not comparable. M0n0 can only service 20% of the community 
> that SW and IPcop target.

It is not designed to fill these niches directly but indirectly it does
support almost ALL of them saving only dialup modem. Most people
seriously using ISDN or DSL in an enterprise environment would be using
it with a dedicated isdn/dsl router that would easily be able to hand
off to the firewall with ethernet.





> 3) I agree with Mark from day one I didnt want IDS or Squid on the box, and 
> I've never used them - it was there because sometimes as a team leader you 
> can't always throw toys out your pram - you have to be nice and say ok... while 
> weighing up security risk.
> 4) M0n0 doesn't do the quality of logging that SW does and nor does it have the 
> ease of use and installation that I designed from day one using libnewt.

Mono does exactly the same quality of logging .... kernel level logging
that can be viewed in the gui or more importantly easily sent to a
central logging server.

I will give you that Smoothwall has ease of use but it's primarily
because it's interface isn't nearly as flexible and gives far less
control to the end user. 

As for ease of installation ... I can't imagine an installation much
easier than putting a CD in a drive and a floppy in a drive and pressing
power
 
> 5) M0n0 doesn't have the depth of usability (or user friendliness that SW does)

Monowall is MUCH better at the core function which is AN ACTUAL FIREWALL
than smoothwall is. If you are a business looking for a firewall and you
know what you are doing that's what you want ... not all the fluff. I
will say that it isn't as easy because you have to understand what a
firewall is and what is it supposed to do and actually define rules to
pass traffic ..... but if you are managing a firewall and don't know
these things ....well ... you are probably an MCSE and should not be
entrusted to do this work to begin with. 


> 6) M0n0 doesn't have the hardware support for devices because of fact its 
> FreeBSD based.
No ... this is true .... it's very simple just support for the devices
it was designed for nothing more and no extra. It's light and fast. 
No trying to wedge in the kitchen sink just because someone thought it
was nifty.

And no ... I am not a freebsd lover .. I prefer linux 
as a real firewall and just a firewall M0n0 is just better

> Saying that I financially contribute to M0n0 and see Marcel's work as 
> fundamentally important to succeed. As with everything you have to decide on 
> targets. SW did a huge amount in a short period while morons slashdotted me 
> they forgot we were changing the way the industry worked.

Change is sometimes good ... but not always. There are times when a
mutation occurs that evolution does away with because it was a flaw not 
a feature for the species.

M0n0wall has the underpinnings of an enterprise class firewall product
and with very little tweaking will be the whole way there. Smoothwall
has the underpinnings of a small office/soho broadband router.

That being said if you require no real flexibility or control whatsoever
from the primary interface I would say use smoothwall in a heartbeat. 



> 
> Richard
> 
> 
> Quoting Mark Spieth <mspieth at neod dot net>:
> 
> > I agree, I like IDS however IDS really should be done on a separate box
> > as well as squid 1/2 the smoothwall/IPCOP patches are do to addon
> > software they put on their firewalls.
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Donald Deacon [mailto:donald at 501 dot co dot za] 
> > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 7:57 AM
> > To: m0n0wall at lists dot m0n0 dot ch
> > Subject: Re: [m0n0wall] Comparative Products to M0n0wall
> > 
> > I agree! M0n0wall has some really cool features like creating aliases of
> > Networks/Host names. This makes changes quick and easy, especially to
> > Rules
> > and Nat setups. I use a CDROM based PC. No hard drive to worry about
> > crashing also less power usage. If there are any problems, you reboot!I
> > looked at Smoothwall and besides IDS there was nothing that benefited
> > us!
> > 
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: "Mark Spieth" <mspieth at neod dot net>
> > To: <m0n0wall at lists dot m0n0 dot ch>
> > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 12:49 PM
> > Subject: RE: [m0n0wall] Comparative Products to M0n0wall
> > 
> > 
> > I understand your dilemma, however what other products offer is
> > irrelevant, the real issue is does monowall fulfill your security needs
> > for the price you pay for it. There are other free products out there
> > such as IPcop for a prebuilt system or shorewall if you want to build
> > your own. The added security of the FreeBSD based system and ease of
> > upgrade especially if you are running a standard PC with a CDROM is what
> > is important.
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Andy Prasetya [mailto:andyprasetya at netscape dot net]
> > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 1:48 AM
> > To: m0n0wall at lists dot m0n0 dot ch
> > Subject: [m0n0wall] Comparative Products to M0n0wall
> > 
> > Dear M0n0wall Community,
> > Recently, my supervisor asked me to develop a comparative
> > chart/information about M0n0wall and other "peer-class/quality"
> > products. Does anybody can help me to find some few (at least 3 or 4
> > products) which can be compared to a M0n0wall box, in terms of their
> > features?
> > 
> > Thank you very much.
> > andyprasetya at netscape dot net
> > 
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> 
> 
> 
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